HotBedInfo, 6/29/11
We are not exactly Rome, but as any over-extended empire such as the U.S., you can start to see the startling similarities between the two when you look back to Rome’s self-destruction. America and Rome both have morphed from a republic to an empire of confusion.
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
Our founding fathers realized what happened to the Roman republic. The debates at the Philadelphia Convention, concerning ratification of the Constitution, make frequent reference to the problem of how and why republics die. Rome was certainly one of the more common examples. One of the arguments against replacing the Articles of Confederation with an all-powerful national government was that republics on such a vast scale were impractical. Rome was used as an example of this. Thus, our Constitution created a national government of limited power.
The following are examples of how the two empires are identical in their self-destruction.
1. Over-Extended Military - Rome was a republic that turned into an empire. Both empires have extended their military across the known world far beyond their economic sensibilities. It’s power spread from the middle east to Africa and Europe. The United States was once a Republic, but today, our military bases operate as an empire in dozens of countries around the world. Our president and Congress provoke wars on sovereign nations at will: Korea, Vietnam, Bosnia, Kuwait, Iraq and potentially Iran. The United States morphs into world conquests without end. America displays the same calamities that destroyed Rome.
2. Government Corruption – The Roman Empire fell because it was bankrupted by its leaders. Roman Senators were selfish and self-absorbed, determined to hoard the huge wealth of the empire and enhance their wealth even further. The common people lost all power.
3. Immigration - Rome found itself increasingly using “illegal immigrants” from outside their nation to do the agricultural work that Romans would not do. ”Roman government allowed uncontrolled hostile immigration to dissolve the fabric of their civilization. Illegal and legal Immigrants grew more powerful while exercising their own character of their cultures. They did not adopt Roman ways. Second, vast blocks of once Roman lands became foreign held and even the Roman population, once outnumbered, was no match for hostile immigrants.” Reference: “The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and Barbarians,” by Peter Heather. “Factors that destroyed Rome now manifest in accelerating numbers in America. Los Angeles, Miami, Chicago, Detroit, Atlanta, New York City, San Francisco, Raleigh and all large cities suffer millions of illegal immigrants. Uncounted millions of them cannot and do not speak English. Millions work under the table without paying taxes. Millions use our hospitals without paying. They immigrate but do not assimilate. They colonize in ethnic enclaves separated from Americans. They fracture our country.” Reference (LINK)
4. Birth Control - Decrease of Roman birth rates. Abortion, contraception, infanticide, prostitution, and perversion dramatically lowered birthrates.
5. Elimination of the Middle Class - The middle class of ancient Rome were Equestrians. they were the merchants and traders and were allowed certain political positions. In the earliest days of the Republic Rome’s taxes were quite modest, consisting mainly of a wealth tax on all forms of property, including land, houses, slaves, animals, money and personal effects. Beginning with the third century B.C. Roman economic policy started to contrast more and more sharply with that in the Hellenistic world, especially Egypt. In Greece and Egypt economic policy had gradually become highly regimented, depriving individuals of the freedom to pursue personal profit in production or trade, crushing them under a heavy burden of oppressive taxation, and forcing workers into vast collectives where they were little better than bees in a great hive. (LINK)
6. Obsession with Sports and Entertainment -The Roman poet Juvenal (circa 100 A.D.) wrote regarding the way latter-day Roman emperors retained power and control over the masses that were seemingly more than happy to obsess themselves with trivialities and self-indulgences while their once-great-and-powerful empire collapsed before their very eyes. He wrote:
“Already long ago, from when we sold our vote to no man, the People have abdicated our duties; for the People who once upon a time handed out military command, high civil office, legions–everything, now restrains itself and anxiously hopes for just two things: bread and circuses.” (Wikipedia) (LINK)
Many American men have allowed sports to control and dominate their lives. With many, sports are not just a hobby; they are a religion. When men stripped their shirts off and painted their faces, they were heading to the battlefield to kill their enemies. Now they are headed off to the sports coliseum to watch a football game. A man’s ego and machismo was once used to protect his family and freedom; now it’s used to follow batting averages and box scores.
Scholars are generally consistent in noting that one of the factors in the “Fall” of Rome was the Roman obsession with entertainment and consequent loss of civic duty. (“bread and circuses”) In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.
7. Redistribution of Wealth -Roman politicians devised a plan in 140 B.C. to win the votes of the poor: giving out cheap food and entertainment, “bread and circuses”, would be the most effective way to rise to power. The Roman practice of providing free wheat to Roman citizens as well as costly circus games and other forms of entertainment as a means of gaining political power through populism, is a perfect parallel to how America in this post modern age is succumbing to the same distractions while ignoring the crumbling infrastructure of abandoned principles.
Like the Romans, the spending of public money for free “bread and circuses” for the populace, the concept of “redistribution of wealth,” taxing those who have and giving to those who have not, has become part of the American way of life with the New Deal and the Great Society. The result has been an excessive burden of taxation on the middle, working class of Americans
8. Exporting “Culture” - Rome’s greatest conquest was the seduction of its’ peoples. They would provide them with baths, and central heating as the people never realized that they were enslaved by such wonderful things. In the United States we have McDonald’s, Starbucks, and many other known American companies popping up in every major city on earth. Romans also put down “roots” all over their occupied territories and left their cultural and architectural footprint on the world. We also have as the Romans did, an obsession with comfort and pleasure that distracted the population from important issues and made the citizens apathetic, only concerned about disruptions in their own personal pleasures to the peril of their communities.
9. Morality – Dr. Carle Zimmerman in 1947 wrote a book called Family and Civilization. He studies the decline of several civilizations and empires. He discovered eight patterns of domestic behavior that signaled the decline of a civilization: (LINK)
A. The breakdown of marriage and rise of divorce.
B. The loss of the traditional meaning of the marriage ceremony.
C.. The rise of Feminism.
D. Increased public disrespect for parents and authority in general.
E. Acceleration of juvenile delinquency, promiscuity and rebellion.
F. Refusal of people with traditional marriages to accept their family responsibilities.
G. A growing desire for and acceptance of adultery.
H. Increasing interest in and spread of sexual perversions and sex-related crimes.
See any parallels in modern America?
10. Inflation – As early as the rule of Nero (54-68 A.D.) there is evidence that the demand for revenue led to debasement of the Roman coinage. Revenue was needed to pay the increasing costs of defense and a growing bureaucracy. However, rather than raise taxes, Nero and subsequent emperors preferred to debase the currency by reducing the precious metal content of coins. This was, of course, a form of taxation; in this case, a tax on cash balances (Bailey 1956). Throughout most of the Empire, the basic units of Roman coinage were the gold aureus, the silver denarius, and the copper or bronze sesterces. Most emperors continued the policies of debasement and increasingly heavy taxes, levied mainly on the wealthy. The war against wealth was not simply due to purely fiscal requirements, but was also part of a conscious policy of exterminating the Senatorial class, which had ruled Rome since ancient times.
As the private wealth of the Empire was gradually confiscated or taxed away, driven away or hidden, economic growth slowed to a virtual standstill. Moreover, once the wealthy were no longer able to pay the state’s bills, the burden inexorably fell onto the lower classes, so that average people suffered as well from the deteriorating economic conditions. (LINK)
At this point, in the third century A.D., the money economy completely broke down. Yet the military demands of the state remained high. Rome’s borders were under continual pressure from Germanic tribes in the North and from the Persians in the East. In the United States currently, our money has been weakened through inflation by excessive government spending catering to entitlement social programs, military conquests and “National Security” We are at a dangerous brink of an inevitable economic collapse.
Does all of this sound familiar?
If you can’t see this coming, and most Americans don’t, you will eventually. If you don’t speak out your children will pay the price for your lack of courage. Our accelerated collapse will place our civilization in the history books right along side Rome’s
References
“The Fall of the Roman Empire: A New History of Rome and Barbarians,” Peter Heather examines the exact cause of Rome’s death.
For the book by Edward Gibbon, see The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire.
The middle class of ancient Rome were the Equestrians. They were the merchants and traders and were allowed certain political positions.
Denial of the facts will not make them go away.
It seems that the liberal is more prone to disbelieve the facts.
Delusion runs rampant on their camp.
[...] Students will read the following article: http://hotbedinfo.com/2011/06/top-10-similarities-between-the-fall-of-rome-and-the-fall-of-america/ [...]
Constantine converted to Christianity, despite what others have written here, but for reasons of military politics. An increasing number of Roman soldiers became Christians and Constantine had no choice but to appease them. I doubt Constantine’s Edict of Milan was heartfelt on his part. He simply needed an army to fight for him and that meant the respect of his soldiers. That being said, immigration and heavy taxation along with a flood of imports murdered Rome. The US is on its death bed with the same Roman arrogance and illness.
If you haven’t already, check out the book “Are We Rome? The Fall of an Empire and the Fate of America” by Cullen Murphy.
You completely missed the reality of this post. Morality is the foundation of a prosperous society.
YES. Immoral societies do not prosper. America was founded on the completely OPPOSITE priniciples. Nice try.
Actually, it’s a historical fact that birth control decreases population. Please relinquish your conditioning. Also another historical fact: Romans were overun by foreigners in their time.. AKA barbarians, nomads, Your Politically Correct brainwashing is evident.
Emperor Constantine I, pretended to convert to christianity so as to sustain power.
After the so called conversion, he contined to build sun god temples. Yes, this is fact.
No Roman Caesar converted to christianity. They were pagan sun god worshippers( modern day freemasons)
Constantine I, goes down as being a good man. A saint. He was twisted with evil. Look into the non-traditional history.
Is it a coincidence that the monarchy also pretended to convert to christianity?
The monarchy have headed the order of freemasonry, since 955AD
In light of this, another fact – The King James bible when first released
was rife with freemasonry and freemasonry symbols, check it for yourself.
Now, this bible caused problems with Rome. It was the first time England
did push away from pope rule of the church.
Then there is the church. Evey church is rife with freemasonry symbolism.
Check it out for yourselfs.
This was the most important discovey.- the monarchy the world over, is related.
And whats worse, back to the Caesar DNA.( i got this far )
This would align 100% with the epigenetic expressions we see today -
Greed, sexual perversion, megalomania, childish.
The fact that King Charlemagne is at the root of our monarchy and a descendant of the Caesar family.( interbred since ancient times),and that they all experience the same environment
of power and luxery , through each generation only increases the chance of these inherited traits.
You had me until the bit on immigrants. I kept reading anyway and saw the bits on sex ideals and birth control. It is quite evident you are a conservative propagandist.
This whole article is largely exaggerated and just terrible. Are you honestly telling me that birth control, feminism, and lack of tradition marriage is leading to the fall of America? Jesus, this is the worst piece of shit I’ve ever read.
Could have been informative, but was steeped in propaganda. An interest in human rights is not equal to the fall of a society.
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
The rise and fall of Empires is as predict cable as water flowing down hill. Many factors caused Rome to fall not the least of which were poor leadership, lack of moral substance and a general apathy that rooted itself in Roman culture over several centuries. The parallels are very clear with modern America. From an individual perspective there is little that can be done. It does leave a person wondering. To say that we have 100′s of years is foolish. In 1929 the world changed overnight and within 3 years 30% unemployment existed followed by a world war of catastrophic proportions.
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
[...] As Kyle Trottier writes, “In many modern books written about Ancient Rome and her people, the ancient Romans are often portrayed as people who enjoyed violence and thought it amusing to see people being injured and killed to the point of obsession. It is now common knowledge that, in Ancient Rome, people often attended (and enjoyed) gladiatorial fights to the death, wild beast hunts, naval battles and chariot racing. Some public thinkers today have suggested that “entertainment” today, as it was in ancient times of Rome, reflects the decline of culture, into a plethora of lust, greed, violence, selfish individualism and bad behavior. Some Scholars suggest that history is repeating itself and we are now in a reoccurring cycle of moral decay and social breakdown. From the excessive amount of glorified violence in Hollywood movies, video games, music and on the internet, one can easily see the downward spiral of decency.” [...]
Interesting study, albeit inherently flawed. From reading this article, and the comments about it, I am concerned with the apparent over-exageration of America’s “decline”. It seems as if you all feel America is ‘worse off’ than ever before. This is not the case, when experts are speaking of our decline, it is a ‘relative’ decline, not an absolute decline. We are NOT worse off than before, in fact, compared to our own history, we are doing well. Our lowest class of citizens enjoy amenities never even dreamt of by the same class of people in the 1950s. What we are failing in is maintaining our position as an innovative leader in the world. Other nations are catching up, but not by much. Our biggest ‘threat’ is China. And even China is decades away from being even a stronger REGIONAL power than we are in Asia. This means that our biggest fear is losing SOME power in a place across the world from our country. It is absurd to think we are in some sort of free-fall to chaos. We MUST be a progressive nation, and if we halt this progression we will simply lose relative power.
hey homie g
Rob said “Intersting article. Althhough its decidedly rght wing on some points (birth control and some of morality)”
How stupid can you be? No duh. The whole point is that your leftist ideals are destroying America in the same way they destroyed Rome. I am sure some idiots in Rome, when confronted with similar evidence about the Greeks, said the same thing, completely asleep to the fact that they are the problem.
Thanks for the interest, Rob.
Sorry though, I don’t equate “morality” with being “right-wing” lol.
“Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.”
John Adams – 2nd President of the United States
Also regarding coffee, most people i know that drink coffee in the middle of the day at meetings with friends or for business, do it to perk up, not really for leisure, I wouldnt compare it all to sitting around and drinking alcohol to relax, caffeine has an opposite effect that makes some people chatty.
Interesting study.
Intersting article. Althhough its decidedly rght wing on some points (birth control and some of morality), it does make you wonder how long will America last. I’m a grad student and one study I’m working on is tracing the use of coffee as a tool in production. In the past coffee was used in the work place as a stimulant. It cleared the mind and maintained productivity throughout the day. America has transitioned coffee to a drink of leisure. Today coffee is not only different nutritionally (eg increaed sugar dairy calorie) the connotations of “having a cup of coffee” in the middle of the day means “time to relax.” My study is not even close to done, but I have already found a decrease in employee loyalty around the rise in popularity of Starbucks.
You stated: “Between July 5th and August 1st 2011, the US, Israel and Nato will launch the war of
all wars against Iran.” I find that inaccurate considering the U.S. government and Obama have been distancing themselves from Israel. If Israel does go to war with Iran, i highly doubt, for better or for worse, that the U.S. will be by their side.
WHAT IS HAPPENING IN US MEDIA CIRCLES IS JUST ANOTHER RUSE! THE LARGEST WAR IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD IS ABOUT TO BE FOUGHT!
Add up all the propaganda that has besieged the media world the last couple of years.
The result: a campaign to make our adversaries believe that the US is a crumbling and
disintegrating civilization, one which is too weak and dysfunctional to engage IRAN! Even Bob Brinker, on his financial radio show on 6.26.11 referred to the government as “DYSFUNCTIONAL”. The Big War is coming!
The US government will begin frightening people so they begin hording cash, food and fuel. One way of doing this is by saying that payments to Social Security will not be going out on time, because of the budget impasse. Retail sales will begin to tank. Civil unrest will increase. The stock market will begin a dramatic and historic decline. There will be saber rattling between Washington and Iran. The attack will probably occur on a weekend US evening, to minimize civil unrest. Martial law will be imposed, if we survive.
Listen to the Republican Presidential contenders. The fear and apprehension in their speeches, speaks for itself. They know what is coming! All they can produce are garbled sound bites. They are directionless. Did you listen to the president and his latest press conference? There is fear in his voice!
For example; The power vacuum created by the riots in the middle east (high food prices
created by the US government and its foolish ethanol program) are acting like a magnet
for terrorist organizations to establish themselves in these countries. These entities
are now more concerned about their political advancement rather than a military one.
They are now preoccupied by their new paradigm. When this war is fought, they will be
disintegrated by the war machine and the Nukes that Iran has had for 20 years, when it
attacks Israel.
Between July 5th and August 1st 2011, the US, Israel and Nato will launch the war of
all wars against Iran. We will lose. They will lose. There shall be no winners! Prepare yourself!
If the government survives, The stock market will be closed indefinitely, otherwise, it will no longer exist!.
The banking system will collapse. All major banks will shutter.
The ensuing panic will collapse all infrastructures.
Civil unrest will occur all over the nation.
It will be difficult, if not impossible to find food.
The elderly, infirm and those needing the basics of medicine will die.
Mass unemployment will result in riots and burnings.
After a nuclear incident, the confusion and resulting casualties would deem the US impotent, militarily and economically. Even if Israel and the US were to destroy Iran, the devastation would have a profound effect globally. The radioactive fallout alone, will affect all of the neighboring countries. This would also allow the US to suspend and not default on its debt. Do ya see it coming? Don’t forget an ally to Iran, that has nuclear weapons. That is North Korea! They can take out South Korea, and Hawaii. It may not be a good idea to buy a KIA right now. Do ya see it coming?
You will notice that the political rhetoric will intensify in the next few weeks, until the war actually happens. And it will! It has been planned for a long time!
It has been said for the last decade, that there are suitcase nuclear bombs in the US. When the war occurs, we will be finding out if they are right or wrong. That is, if we survive!
Pakistan and India may go at it, at the same time we engage in the war. They both have nuclear weapons and are adversaries.
Don’t let a good conflict(crisis) go to waste
Beware the Government Media Complex!
Is a lot more complex with modern day U.S. System, Politician is been influence by big corporation not like individual rich like Roman or in the 1800′s in the U.S. Main problem with go global company, a lot of the employee is from here, maybe some employee but definote not majority, so they can avoid a lot of taxes.
Excellent article.
IMHO, the majority of issues facing the US have been engineered in a very scientific manner by a place called the Tavistock Institute. Those doing the engineering no longer have need of what the US stood for and are in the last stages of destroying it.
Although more and more people are waking up…so all is not lost yet.
Todd, I absolutely agree however when you make a statement like that it would be best to check your spelling.
Great article
Great article and it is so true, thanks very much for sharing!
I agree Bettie! I think that something may be the economy unfortunately. I agree with many leading voices in this field right now saying that by the time most people wake up, it will be already too late! I hope not…
I have heard about this for a long long time and we the people need to take charge. But as you say, most people don’t want to believe it. something’s gotta give!
Thanks for the read Todd, i agree! Most people would rather not know such things. I cannot live in a bubble any longer. I would prepare the best you can.
This article is absolutely amazing and addresses all of the issues of our times.
We are a nations of morons